indoor lighting for super 8

[mercerscott]

I am interested in how artificial lighting functions with super8. For instance, if I wanted to film a bar scene, which obviously is too poorly lit for any super8 film, how do I light it? I want to retain the character of a dimly lit bar, and not just use a powerful fill light. Is it a waste of time due to the limitations of this film?

[tom hardwick]

Certainly not a waste of time lighting for film. Aim to "light the walls" rather than directly light the actors - that way you can up the lighting levels but still underexpose the people, leaving them on more shadow than is technically "correct".

tom.

[mattias]

replace all the lights visible in the shot with 100 watt bulbs, and all lights outside the shot with 200 watt bulbs. and don't be afraid to just shine a couple of strong lights into the scene if "needed". just do it from an angle and the low key look will remain. and don't forget to fill the room with smoke.

[#Pedro]

I think replacing the existing bulbs with 100/200W is a very good idea. If the light isn?t already sufficient, a indirect general light will help (against a wall etc). Additionally I would place a few spotlights to make the hair of the actors shine (behind the szene, against the camera), and to highlight the faces of the main actors, imitating the direction of the "natural" light. Perhaps some color filters in front of the lamps will give the real bar mood. In any case it is better to provide a sufficient lighting and close the iris manualy by 1 stop as to balance the light to the minimum possible and shoot with open stop.
Pedro

[mercerscott]

All of you have been great. I had no idea that I could get such quick and authoritative answers to questions. I am assuming that the 100W/200watt bulb idea will be sufficient for Kodak 200 speed Tri-x film? My worry is that there will not be enough ambient light for the camera, even though the spot light is sufficient to illuminate the actor. I do have a setting on my camera that opens or closes 2 stops when camera is in automatic exposure mode. Though I have produced some very good images with automatically exposed outdooor lighting, I am inexperienced using manual aperture settings. Is there a resource online where I can learn quickly about this subject with out slogging through too much extraneous info?

[#Pedro]

If you spot-light the actor, zoom in his face to measure the light, fix the stop, zoom back and shoot. If the background appear about 2 stops darker than the actor (requesting opening iris for 2 stops), it will be reproduced darker but recognizable, good for the mood. If you want the actor?s face darker than normal, close the stop slightly (maximum 1 stop).
The problem with automatic exposure is, that it only works when all objects have a similar brighness. With contrasty indoors it isn?t so. Therefore you have to decide what you want to be reproduced correctly and what not. And you decide measuring with the zoom lens like a spot-meter. If the difference to the background is bigger as you want it to be, you can light the background until you receive the desired measuring result.
F.e. actor?s face: 1:4, people behind him, 1:1,4. Closed the iris to stop 4 and you get the actor?s face bright, the surrounding people significantly darker.
Pedro

[Alex]

Do what the 35mm cinematographers do...cheat!

Get a polaroid camera! You can match it to the film you are using and get your answer within a minute!

http://www.fourdesigns.com/cameras/cameras.html

[Nigel]

Also--people tend to be really stupid when they are watching a movie. Think of James Bond--have you ever seen a light in a sewer under the desert? I haven't but, I still don't think twice about it.

[pcg]

Wise response, Nigel. We all tend to forget that we each suspend our disbelief when we're successfully sucked into a good flick.

Another example: almost all indoor shots have strong unidirectional light on an actor's face. You'll never find that in actual room lighting, but we don't think twice about it.

So as filmmakers, we're not trying as much to create reality, as to tell a hell of a good story. What drives a good film? Emotion, not lighting. I can't remember walking out of a movie remarking on the fantastic lighting (except maybe in an old Bergman)...!

/Pat

[mattias]

duh, i've walked out of theaters remarking on the lighting about one million times - and even more often have i remarked about the editing and directing. i must say i can't enjoy movies as much now that i work in the industry myself, unless they are "perfect". a couple of drinks before and a highly emotional storyline helps somewhat though. ;-)